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contre personne non-dénommée

English translation: against a fictitious/unidentified defendant

12:22 Jun 24, 2017
French to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Law (general)
French term or phrase: contre personne non-dénommée
Report on progress of a case
"Pour répondre à ces moyens adversairement soutenus, il a été nécessaire : ... de déposer une plainte formelle contre personne non-dénommée avec constitu¬tion de partie civile auprès du Doyen des Juges d'Instruction...
Un dépôt de plainte contre personne non-dénommée avec constitution de partie civile auprès du Juge d'Instruction ne peut intervenir que dans le cas où le Parquet décide de classer sans suite la plainte simple qu'il a reçue, ou bien s'il ne répond pas dans les trois mois du dépôt de la plainte simple."

Nice equivalent English legalese expression?
Mpoma
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:44
English translation:against a fictitious/unidentified defendant
Explanation:
Although I think the more literal translation provided by others here would be okay, there is in fact a "legalese" term in English, the "fictitious defendant." These lawsuits are sometimes called "John Doe lawsuits" in the U.S. I am including some references.

Another valid option is "unidentified defendant" if you do not feel that "fictitious defendant" suits your context.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2017-06-24 16:31:26 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Apparently "John Doe Injunction" is used in the UK and the term in fact originated there.

This is an interesting example:

"The term 'John Doe Injunction' (or John Doe Order)[11] is used in the UK to describe an injunction sought against someone whose identity is not known at the time it is issued:

"8.02 If an unknown person has possession of the confidential personal information and is threatening to disclose it, a 'John Doe' injunction may be sought against that person. The first time this form of injunction was used since 1852 in the United Kingdom was in 2005 when lawyers acting for JK Rowling and her publishers obtained an interim order against an unidentified person who had offered to sell chapters of a stolen copy of an unpublished Harry Potter novel to the media".[12]"

Also:

" This practice is widely used in the United States and Canada, but is always used in other English-speaking countries including the United Kingdom, from which the use of "John Doe" in a legal context originates."


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Doe

This brings me to another option: "unidentified person."

Selected response from:

Dareth Pray
United States
Local time: 01:44
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +2against unknown person
telefpro
3 +2against a fictitious/unidentified defendant
Dareth Pray


Discussion entries: 1





  

Answers


26 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
against unknown person


Explanation:
creio que seja util

telefpro
Local time: 14:14
Native speaker of: Native in PortuguesePortuguese, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8
Notes to answerer
Asker: I think there's no point in just guessing like this... you can assume that a French to English translator doing legal texts can guess themselves if they need to. You don't even offer French as one of your languages.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  AllegroTrans: against AN unknown person "or person unknown" http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/715228/Pippa-Middleton-acti...
3 mins
agree  Francois Boye
1 hr
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
against a fictitious/unidentified defendant


Explanation:
Although I think the more literal translation provided by others here would be okay, there is in fact a "legalese" term in English, the "fictitious defendant." These lawsuits are sometimes called "John Doe lawsuits" in the U.S. I am including some references.

Another valid option is "unidentified defendant" if you do not feel that "fictitious defendant" suits your context.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2017-06-24 16:31:26 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Apparently "John Doe Injunction" is used in the UK and the term in fact originated there.

This is an interesting example:

"The term 'John Doe Injunction' (or John Doe Order)[11] is used in the UK to describe an injunction sought against someone whose identity is not known at the time it is issued:

"8.02 If an unknown person has possession of the confidential personal information and is threatening to disclose it, a 'John Doe' injunction may be sought against that person. The first time this form of injunction was used since 1852 in the United Kingdom was in 2005 when lawyers acting for JK Rowling and her publishers obtained an interim order against an unidentified person who had offered to sell chapters of a stolen copy of an unpublished Harry Potter novel to the media".[12]"

Also:

" This practice is widely used in the United States and Canada, but is always used in other English-speaking countries including the United Kingdom, from which the use of "John Doe" in a legal context originates."


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Doe

This brings me to another option: "unidentified person."




    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fictitious_defendants
    Reference: http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/John+Doe+lawsu...
Dareth Pray
United States
Local time: 01:44
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 29
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thanks... yes, I wonder what "John Doe lawsuit" is in the UK?

Asker: "against a person or persons unknown"?

Asker: Haha... that *is* amusing in fact. And one can imagine the kind of kicking one would get from a reviser who knew that the text was meant to be translated into UK legalese. Of course this phenomenon crops up with general language too, as is well known: in UK we would never use "gotten" but I think Shakespeare and co did. I've come across other examples pertaining to such "division by a common language" over the years...


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  AllegroTrans: you can sue a fictitious defendant? surely you mean "unknown"?/ we NEVER use "John Doe" in the UK, the term is always "person or persons unknown"; your refs are from the US and not reliable for UK, sorry
37 mins
  -> Yes, it is a legal term of art, although a strange one. Please see the references I included. // it is interesting that John Doe is no longer used in the UK although it came from the UK originally. Funny isn't it?
agree  Michele Fauble: 'persons unknown'
8 hrs
neutral  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: UK: "persons unknown"
9 hrs
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