| Էջերը այս նյութում: < [1 2 3] | I must be missing something.... Շարքի հրապարակողը: Paul Stevens
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Jaroslaw Michalak 
Լեհաստան
Local time: 23:01
Անդամ (2004)
անգլերենից լեհերեն
SITE LOCALIZER | Fell through the cracks... | Aug 4, 2011 |
As I understand it, the topic is that it is possible to be a CertifiedPro and at the same time drastically abuse the KudoZ peer-help system and display total disregard to generally understood rules of translators' professional conduct.
I would say that it is in the 2583 members' best interest to discuss the matter to make sure that controls are in place that prevent such devaluation of the system.
| | | | Paul Stevens
Local time: 22:01
իսպաներենից անգլերեն
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TOPIC STARTER | Possibilities | Aug 5, 2011 |
Allison Wright wrote:
...one motivation for discussing this issue at length may be that we view ourselves (at ProZ) - or perhaps feel that others (e.g. clients) view us - as a group. As such when one of us behaves in a way which is - or may be viewed as - belittling to the professional status we have worked so hard to achieve and maintain, then some of us feel the need to object.
Nicely put, Alison!
Jabberwock wrote:
As I understand it, the topic is that it is possible to ... display total disregard to generally understood rules of translators' professional conduct.
I would say that it is in the 2583 members' best interest to discuss the matter to make sure that controls are in place that prevent such devaluation of the system.
Agreed, Jabberwock. The bottom line is that this translator (whether he/she is a Certified Pro or not) should not have accepted this particular job as he/she is clearly not qualified to do it justice without a lot of assistance from his/her peers. For the purpose of the rest of this post, I’d like to label such translators “rogue” translators.
I am of the opinion that the current KudoZ rules effectively encourage any rogue translator who is a proz member to behave in this manner because he/she is aware that he/she can (unless I am mistaken) ask up to 15 questions per day and 60 questions per week (and non-members, I believe, 5 per day and 20 per week) and thereby take advantage of the goodwill of other, more professional, translators to complete the job which he/she should not have taken on in the first place.
My own experience has shown that, whilst a text may sometimes contain the odd phrase on which I might require the assistance of my peers, I have never experienced (and certainly would not envisage) a scenario where I would need to post anything like 15 terminology queries per day. Indeed, I would think that 5 per day would be a highly exceptional case. I would therefore propose that the limit for members should be reduced to 5 per day and 20 per week, with the limit for members also being reduced correspondingly if the powers that be at proz.com deem it appropriate.
This, I believe, would help to restrict this rogue use of the KudoZ system, but I know that a reduction in the number of questions allowed has been put forward before and no action has been taken to implement it.
I also seem to recall it being mentioned on another thread that the current limit can be waived if a support request is submitted. This, IMO, is not only totally ridiculous but also demonstrates the site’s apparent desire not to discourage rogue translators from taking on jobs which they are clearly not fit to undertake. For a site which is supposed to represent the professional translation industry, I believe that this is unacceptable and I would strongly recommend that such a waiver be dispensed with immediately.
Finally, as mentioned previously in this thread, I feel that the option to hide your previous KudoZ history and information should be withdrawn as it is another factor which effectively encourages rogue translators, since, by hiding this information, other translators who are unaware of the relevant rogue translator and his/her KudoZ history will be prepared to answer questions posted by such translators, which they might be discouraged from doing if they could view the asker’s KudoZ history.
[Edited at 2011-08-05 07:43 GMT]
| | | | Holly Nathan (X)
Իտալիա
Local time: 23:01
իտալերենից անգլերեն
| It's all about the money | Aug 5, 2011 |
Jabberwock wrote:
.
Agreed, Jabberwock. The bottom line is that this translator (whether he/she is a Certified Pro or not) should not have accepted this particular job as he/she is clearly not qualified to do it justice without a lot of assistance from his/her peers. For the purpose of the rest of this post, I’d like to label such translators “rogue” translators.
[Edited at 2011-08-05 07:43 GMT] [/quote]
I suppose it's the same with all language pairs and kudoz but, basically, if I personally wanted a translation from IT-EN of a text to do with wine I would know EXACTLY who to contact on proz (just based on all the answers I see them give in this field, without having to go to their profile and look in their kudoz bit I mean). This is the same for law (two people there) and the same for finance and the same for literature (two there also). I see them give such good answers all the time that sometimes when I need to ask a kudoz question myself I am tempted just to email them directly and cut out anybody who might give me a google translate job! However, I imagine that these people do not accept low rates, so if a client only wants to spend 0.03 euro per word then who will they get for the job but "rogue" translators? If the client is a regular user of proz (and kudoz) then they will see that they have just given the job to somebody who doesn't know much but that person ends up finding out all the answers from the people who do know! It's not fair of course, but if you are offering 0,03 euro a word then it is what happens
| | | | | Why haven't we heard from the "rogue translator"? | Aug 5, 2011 |
Why haven't we heard in this thread from the "rogue translator" herself? Is she even aware of it? Is she blushing to the roots of her hair, or has she already torn it all out in her desperate search for those elusive terms?
Jenny
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Holly Nathan (X)
Իտալիա
Local time: 23:01
իտալերենից անգլերեն
| Oh give them a break! :) | Aug 5, 2011 |
Jenny Forbes wrote:
Why haven't we heard in this thread from the "rogue translator" herself? Is she even aware of it? Is she blushing to the roots of her hair, or has she already torn it all out in her desperate search for those elusive terms?
Jenny
Well, she's/he's not the only one I imagine. Why should she/he come forward anyway? As far as proz rules go, she/he can ask all these questions and be proz certified. She isn't doing anything she shouldn't be doing really. Or he.
And people are obviously prepared to give him or her work. Please don't anybody tell me she is fooling people either. If it is who I think then I saw their profile and the first thing I wondered was how well you could ever possibly know all those languages and fields and be able to translate them all well.
As I said, it's all about the money money money
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Holly Nathan wrote:
Jenny Forbes wrote:
Why haven't we heard in this thread from the "rogue translator" herself? Is she even aware of it? Is she blushing to the roots of her hair, or has she already torn it all out in her desperate search for those elusive terms?
Jenny
Well, she's/he's not the only one I imagine. Why should she/he come forward anyway? As far as proz rules go, she/he can ask all these questions and be proz certified. She isn't doing anything she shouldn't be doing really. Or he.
And people are obviously prepared to give him or her work. Please don't anybody tell me she is fooling people either. If it is who I think then I saw their profile and the first thing I wondered was how well you could ever possibly know all those languages and fields and be able to translate them all well.
As I said, it's all about the money money money
Holly,
Sarcasm was intended.
J
| | | | B D Finch
Ֆրանսիա
Local time: 23:01
ֆրանսերենից անգլերեն
+ ...
Yes, of course it is all about money, which is what the rogue translator is earning on a job that should have gone to somebody qualified to do it and who is kept in that happy position by the silly people who provide her with free answers. When somebody asks that number of questions, many of them so "non-pro", it is highly unlikely that the text linking the terms gleaned from KudoZ is any good. So, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear and I hope she is listening!
| | | | Robert Forstag
Միացյալ Նահանգներ
Local time: 17:01
իսպաներենից անգլերեն
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| Fully agree with Jabberwock and BD | Aug 5, 2011 |
To recapitulate:
1.
The kind of behavior in question most definitely does devalue the site in general and Kudoz and the Certified P program in particular.
2.
Those who empower such dependent and irresponsible behavior by eagerly answering her questions are every bit as unprofessional as she is.
3.
The quality of the translations that are produced by stringing together all the Kudoz answers cannot possibly result in a translation that is an... See more To recapitulate:
1.
The kind of behavior in question most definitely does devalue the site in general and Kudoz and the Certified P program in particular.
2.
Those who empower such dependent and irresponsible behavior by eagerly answering her questions are every bit as unprofessional as she is.
3.
The quality of the translations that are produced by stringing together all the Kudoz answers cannot possibly result in a translation that is any better than minimally acceptable.
4.
Taking into account the time spent posting, reviewing, selecting, and grading such a massive Everest of Kudoz questions, on top of what I can reasonably infer is a low rate for the work being done, logically means that the individual in question cannot be earning more than $3/hour for the shoddy work she is producing, all the while destroying her professional credibility beyond repair.
It is hard to believe that there are not more remunerative and dignified occupational choices.
[Edited at 2011-08-05 17:10 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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philgoddard
Միացյալ Նահանգներ
գերմաներենից անգլերեն
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| I still have no idea who this person is... | Aug 5, 2011 |
... but why doesn't someone send her a link to this discussion?
| | | | | If you want to know | Dec 28, 2011 |
filter recent questions asked on my pair only, and take a look at yesterday morning.
| | | | Samuel Murray
Նիդեռլանդներ
Local time: 23:01
Անդամ (2006)
անգլերենից աֆրիկանս
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| The point of KudoZ is interaction | Dec 28, 2011 |
Charlie Bavington wrote:
Filter recent questions asked on my pair only, and take a look at yesterday morning.
Seven questions in one morning, yes, and many more in the past two weeks, but not one of the recent seven questions have fewer than 2 answers, and some have as many as 7 answers. Even in the questions of last week with zero answers there were discussion entries posted. This means that there is useful interaction between translators, thanks to her questions. If you don't want to be part of that interaction, then filter the asker.
The fact that translators interact on those questions is proof that the system works.
| | | | | Go back to the other thread :-) | Dec 28, 2011 |
Since you're obviously responding to my earlier comment there. I posted here without realising it was a different one. Well, I clicked on it, obviously, and then went off for a while and thought Phil's point was from today's thread.... confused? Me too!
| | | | | Էջերը այս նյութում: < [1 2 3] | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » I must be missing something.... | Trados Business Manager Lite | Create customer quotes and invoices from within Trados Studio
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